# 2283 x64 Goblins too easy to just ignore

**URL:** <https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875>\
**Category:** Suggestions\
**Created:** [March 4, 2015, 9:40am UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875 "2015-03-04T09:40:26Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![BrianNZ](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/briannz/32/45774_2.png) [@BrianNZ](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/BrianNZ)\
**Post date:** [March 4, 2015, 9:40am UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/1 "2015-03-04T09:40:26Z")

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At first I thought it was going to be really hard - the goblins approached me very early on in the game. I only had one footman, and the first wave was 3 of the horned helmet maurauders. My entire camp had to band together to fight them off.

I was pretty scared about the second wave until I noticed where the goblin camp was in relation to my camp. I had my carpenter create 20 simple wooden fences, and just placed them across the only way for the goblins to approach my camp.

Bam, problem “solved”. They can’t pathfind to me through the fences so they immediately become irrelevant. Goblins (and undead, and other beasties) REALLY need a way to break down walls and attack structures, and it needs to be fairly soon because it’s too game-breakingly easy to ignore them at present (they don’t do anything because they can’t get to you; then just create enough wooden swords to temporarily promote everyone to footman, do so, take down one section of fence, and go and slaughter the camp whenever you feel like it).

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**Author:** ![thedrgnrbrn](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/thedrgnrbrn/32/19937_2.png) [@thedrgnrbrn](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/thedrgnrbrn)\
**Post date:** [March 4, 2015, 2:51pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/2 "2015-03-04T14:51:26Z")

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This will probably be addressed pretty quick. I think the building destruction stuff needs to get in before they can really go at it.

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**Author:** ![Relyss](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/relyss/32/41785_2.png) [@Relyss](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Relyss)\
**Post date:** [March 4, 2015, 10:33pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/3 "2015-03-04T22:33:41Z")

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People had goblins spawning inside their city when they made defense walls.

But that was in previous alphas, now with the campaigns…

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**Author:** ![NonBritGit](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/nonbritgit/32/17385_2.png) [@NonBritGit](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/NonBritGit)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 11:29am UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/4 "2015-03-05T11:29:16Z")

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Gawd, imagine if they could destruct or build fences! You’d NEVER stop fighting them and could never get anything else done.

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**Author:** ![Raffo](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/raffo/32/45845_2.png) [@Raffo](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Raffo)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:31pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/5 "2015-03-05T16:31:19Z")

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Well, of course fences should not completely eliminate enemies from the game, “just” slow them down significantly (then there would even be a reasonable difference between a wooden fence or a stone wall/“cobblestone fence”).

It probably makes sense to wait with this for the archer, as only then “slowing down” can be part of a reasonable defense strategy. If your swordsmen are just waiting for the fence to break down, you don’t really gain anything, but if your archers can shoot at the attackers during that time, it’s a whole different story!

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**Author:** ![micheal\_handy76\_mh](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/micheal_handy76_mh/32/28694_2.png) [@micheal\_handy76\_mh](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/micheal_handy76_mh)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:40pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/6 "2015-03-05T16:40:38Z")

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Just imagine when we get archers and other classes to keep them back, to stop them from doing that 😛 . Build tower by gate and other areas, post archer there. DEFENSE DEFENSE

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**Author:** ![Raffo](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/raffo/32/45845_2.png) [@Raffo](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Raffo)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/7 "2015-03-05T16:51:21Z")

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Well, let’s check those updates, it might be happening sooner than expected. [Stonehearth Development Roadmap – Stonehearth](http://stonehearth.net/roadmap/) already states the archer as “in progress”… 😃

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**Author:** ![8BitCrab](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/8bitcrab/32/48512_2.png) [@8BitCrab](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/8BitCrab)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:54pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/8 "2015-03-05T16:54:46Z")

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on the [trello board](https://trello.com/b/4XvM0SUd/stonehearth-community-roadmap) ranged combat is a blue tag.

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**Author:** ![Gridnick](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/gridnick/32/5389_2.png) [@Gridnick](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Gridnick)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 5:00pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/9 "2015-03-05T17:00:35Z")

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> [@Suggestions for Alpha 8-10](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/suggestions-for-alpha-8-10/9504/10):
>
> Alpha 9 - World content (make the world itself a more interesting place) - The Archer

well Tom disagrees, so ranged combat is being worked on as it was planned on for alpha 9

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**Author:** ![8BitCrab](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/8bitcrab/32/48512_2.png) [@8BitCrab](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/8BitCrab)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 5:03pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/10 "2015-03-05T17:03:38Z")

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the date for the game release has also been changed though… 😉

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**Author:** ![Gridnick](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/gridnick/32/5389_2.png) [@Gridnick](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Gridnick)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 5:05pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/11 "2015-03-05T17:05:03Z")

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> [@8BitCrab](#):
>
> the date for the game release date has also been changed though…

well my point was that it was being worked on, like the game but has been delayed for an update where it can have its own

Does that come across too aggressive?

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**Author:** ![8BitCrab](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/8bitcrab/32/48512_2.png) [@8BitCrab](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/8BitCrab)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/12 "2015-03-05T17:06:00Z")

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> [@Gridnick](#):
>
> Does that come across too aggressive?

nope, i just misread your comment, sorry bout’ that.

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**Author:** ![Gridnick](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/gridnick/32/5389_2.png) [@Gridnick](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Gridnick)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 5:08pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/13 "2015-03-05T17:08:02Z")

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[quote=“8BitCrab, post:12, topic:10875”]  
nope, i just misread your comment, sorry bout’ that.  
[/quote]just making sure because i can be very argumentative, i can probably come across quite mean and harsh to some people

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**Author:** ![8BitCrab](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/8bitcrab/32/48512_2.png) [@8BitCrab](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/8BitCrab)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 5:10pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/14 "2015-03-05T17:10:35Z")

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haha, i rarely get offended by people, so you didnt sound mean to me…

**P.S.** i also just noticed that we kinda derailed the comments…

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**Author:** ![BrianNZ](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/briannz/32/45774_2.png) [@BrianNZ](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/BrianNZ)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 9:01pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/15 "2015-03-05T21:01:20Z")

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> [@Gridnick](#):
>
> well Tom disagrees, so ranged combat is being worked on as it was planned on for alpha 9

Someone asked him about it in Tuesday’s stream, and he said ranged combat was at least 3 Alphas away, so don’t hold your breath.

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**Author:** ![Gridnick](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/gridnick/32/5389_2.png) [@Gridnick](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Gridnick)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 9:08pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/16 "2015-03-05T21:08:11Z")

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> [@BrianNZ](#):
>
> Someone asked him about it in Tuesday’s stream, and he said ranged combat was at least 3 Alphas away, so don’t hold your breath.

its only three months away so in june

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**Author:** ![Dwalus](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/dwalus/32/68929_2.png) [@Dwalus](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Dwalus)\
**Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 9:17pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/17 "2015-03-05T21:17:22Z")

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In my opinion, goblins should break down walls by using explosives of some sort. Of course, one one goblin per village at a time would have the profession of saboteur, making such attacks rare but deadly. These breaches would only happen if the goblins were unable to get at you for a while.

WRT the rest of the AI enemies, some creatures could climb or fly over, and more intelligent/industrious enemies would tunnel underneath walls.

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**Author:** ![NonBritGit](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/nonbritgit/32/17385_2.png) [@NonBritGit](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/NonBritGit)\
**Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 5:23pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/18 "2015-03-06T17:23:12Z")

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Speaking of Goblins and Goblin camps… Goblins have completely disappeared from my game after the initial wave and defeat. It’s basically become a ‘peaceful’ game now…

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**Author:** ![krbrowning](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex022/user_avatar/discourse.stonehearth.net/krbrowning/32/45607_2.png) [@krbrowning](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/krbrowning)\
**Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 5:34pm UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/19 "2015-03-06T17:34:00Z")

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I have this same problem

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**Author:** ![Ashiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Ashiver](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/u/Ashiver)\
**Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 3:03am UTC](https://discourse.stonehearth.net/t/2283-x64-goblins-too-easy-to-just-ignore/10875/20 "2015-03-07T03:03:11Z")

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I played a couple games of this alpha, and both times I got approached by goblins by day 2. The first time I immediately declined the shakedown, and got hit by 3 raiders almost immediately. I lost a lot of people, even though I had two footmen and rallied. The second game though, I just didn’t respond to the shakedown. I just let it sit and teched up to Blacksmith, got three footmen, iron armor for two of them, pikes and a steel short sword. Then I declined, but it didn’t matter at that point. A worker somehow wandered into their camp and got killed, but then I sent my footmen over and they killed the camp.

So my suggestions are these

A. The marauders shouldn’t be the first goblins you ever see. Just doesn’t seem right. The difficulty should scale up, starting with thieves, then progressing to footmen waves, and then finally marauders.

B. I don’t feel like they should raid you on day 2 if you decline the goblins. The goblins themselves maybe shouldn’t even spawn on day 2. Just seems off timing wise, even dwarf fortress generally gives you awhile to actually prepare. I suppose technically I could just make a bunch of wooden swords and shields and promote and demote people trying to time the immediate early waves but that seems pretty hardcore for base difficulty.

C. That said, the goblins should definitely deadline faster from the shakedown. My second play I didn’t respond for many days, and right now that’s the best way to handle the goblins. Why bother declining until you are ready? Perhaps they should even hit you harder if it times out, although there should probably be a timer bar if that’s the case. Heck I didn’t really need to decline at all, I could just get to the point of wiping out the camp completely strength wise and go do that without ever responding to the chieftain. As long as they aren’t hitting players with a bunch of marauders on day 2 I think having a reasonable deadline to the shakedown would be much better. Particularly if it even has a UI element of a timer bar.

D… The bronze mace used to be better than the iron mace, but now the iron mace is the strongest weapon you can make. This seems silly, even the steel longsword which is the most difficult to get access to is actually weaker. In fact, taking into consideration material cost and level of the blacksmith the iron mace is now ridiculously good. Perhaps goblin marauders should have goblin specific weapons instead, so the iron mace can be nerfed while preserving the current challenge level of the marauders.

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